MY 1995 MK3 CAVALIER SRI

[btcctroy]

Bet the Crank sensor is plugged into the CTS and vice versa..

That's not possible as the plugs are different

[TurboDan]

I think he means the knock sensor and icv on the mini loom. But even that wouldnt stop it running it would just idle badly. Ive had them the wrong way round a few times before now.

[Envoy CDX]

Bet the Crank sensor is plugged into the CTS and vice versa..

That's not possible as the plugs are different

Aye, the theory is still sound though - something not being plugged in right.

I think he means the knock sensor and icv on the mini loom. But even that wouldnt stop it running it would just idle badly. Ive had them the wrong way round a few times before now.

Probably what I meant, but I do think it will be something as simple as that.

[joe cavalier sri]

I think he means the knock sensor and icv on the mini loom. But even that wouldnt stop it running it would just idle badly. Ive had them the wrong way round a few times before now.

Can you elaborate a bit on that please ?

[joe cavalier sri]

Ive got the crank sensor pluged in on the drivers side and rad pluged in on the passangers side ?

[joe cavalier sri]

I would just like to know what these wires are for what they are connected too please cheers

[Robsey]

There are a couple of assumptions that we can make -

The start and charge loom is working fine as the car cranks quite healthily.
From what I understand, the fuel pump side of things is also fine.

So the problem lies in the Injection control side of things - coil or the power feed to it?
You have already ruled out by substitution, the crank angle sensor, distributor, plugs , leads, rotor etc.

Ignition live feed?

If ECU loom,
Connector X5 pin 8 (black wire), to coil, ignition control module and ECU pin 27 on motronic set-ups.

And Black / red from the ECU loom would go direct to earth, (park / neutral inhibit wire on auto box).
Goes to pin 42 on Motronic ECU's

Okay - If start and charge loom -
Black wire from starter direct to battery +

black / red - from starter terminal 50 to X5 pin 13
from X5 pin 13 to X9 (drivers footwell) pin 4 - still black/red
also from X5 pin 13 to ignition switch terminal 50 (for cranking)

[joe cavalier sri]

There are a couple of assumptions that we can make -

The start and charge loom is working fine as the car cranks quite healthily.
From what I understand, the fuel pump side of things is also fine.

So the problem lies in the Injection control side of things - coil or the power feed to it?
You have already ruled out by substitution, the crank angle sensor, distributor, plugs , leads, rotor etc.

Ignition live feed?

If ECU loom,
Connector X5 pin 8 (black wire), to coil, ignition control module and ECU pin 27 on motronic set-ups.

And Black / red from the ECU loom would go direct to earth, (park / neutral inhibit wire on auto box).
Goes to pin 42 on Motronic ECU's

Okay - If start and charge loom -
Black wire from starter direct to battery +

black / red - from starter terminal 50 to X5 pin 13
from X5 pin 13 to X9 (drivers footwell) pin 4 - still black/red
also from X5 pin 13 to ignition switch terminal 50 (for cranking)

Hummmm I get you sort of lol ill check take some more pics and vids back to you cheers O and there is power up to the coil just nothing out of the coil

[joe cavalier sri]

I was looking on an old post on here and saw this pic and thought my black lose black wire coming from starter could connect up to coil like on this pic here as I just have the blue and red wires from the module connected up to the coil and the plug pluged into the module from the engine loom where does this black wire go to that's connected on coil ?

[joe cavalier sri]

Also would my hall sensor stop my c20xe from sparking its a bit lose forgot to mention that cheers

[btcctroy]

No it would still fire but run in batch firing mode.
So there is power at the coil. Could you tell me what number terminals have power and how did you find that it did.

[Robsey]

There are two small terminals on the coil.

Terminal 1 - blue goes to ignition module.
Terminal 15 - red to ignition module.
Make sure that the coil is securely mounted to the chassis / inner wing.

ignition module pin 1 - no connection
ignition module pin 2 - brown to earth
ignition module pin 3 - black to ecu pin 27
And to X5 pin 8
Ignition module pin 4 - shielded conductor to ecu pin 1

That is the extent of the ignition circuit.

[btcctroy]

It could be the module but I strongly doubt it.
He won't understand that so I've Simplified it.
There are two small terminals on the coil.

Terminal 1 - blue goes to module should have 12v with ignition on but depends if postive or negative switched
Terminal 15 - red to module again as above
Make sure that the coil is securely mounted to the chassis / inner wing.

ignition module pin 1 - no connection this is for a tachometer, yours doesn't need it
ignition module pin 2 - brown to earth 0volts, test between battery + to this terminal for 12volts
ignition module pin 3 - black to ecu pin 27 - this actually comes from the ignition switch and feeds this and pin 27 of ecu, should be 12volts
Ignition module pin 4 - shielded conductor to ecu pin 1 - this is the signal, the ecu switches the module on and so the coil energises. don't worry about this

That is the extent of the ignition circuit.

[joe cavalier sri]

Theres 12v coming from ignition module pin 3

[btcctroy]

When did you check this, certainly not between the time I posted this shit and the time you replied.
Check it all as stated and not from your front room or work

[Robsey]

That black/red.

Is it in the injector loom - if so it needs grounding to earth.
(Start inhibit wire).
remember the injector loom has two arms -
Across the top of the engine for the injector rail and sensor feeds.
and along the bulkhead for the octane plug etc.
black with red stripe or red with black stripe should be on the bulk head section.
if so, this is the start inhibit wire.

If it is a heavy red with a black outer sheath, then this is the main battery live.

Apologies chaps - I know that I have laboured this point a few times.

And finally - If it is indeed on the start and charge loom, then this should be ignition live from the ignition barrel switch. (Terminal 15A).

[Robsey]

That loose black.

I am going to say - simply join it to the other black wire(s) between the ignition module, ecu pin 27 and the X5 connector.

90% of the time, black on Vauxhalls is for ignition live.

(For those who are very pedantic, black can also be telemute or front fogs - neither of which would be in the start / charge loom nor the injection / ecu loom).

[TurboDan]

The black and red he has put up is coming from the starter loom and so as robsey has just said (and everyone else a million times) this is the wire from the ignition switch(key) that makes the starter turn over. So if its turning over then forget that wire all together as it is NOT that.

As for that black wire that could be from anything, my guess is its nothing at all and was part of an old immobiliser circuit which has been joined back up so not needed anymore but I could be wrong.

We need LOADS more picks of the wiring from all different angles close up etc.. the pictures you take are crap!

[joe cavalier sri]

When did you check this, certainly not between the time I posted this shit and the time you replied.
Check it all as stated and not from your front room or work

Sorry I remember'd after i read your post last time the car was out theres 12v ill get more pictures on Wednesday as its been raining heavy here and theres a lot of stuff surrounding the cav in the garage

[joe cavalier sri]

The black and red he has put up is coming from the starter loom and so as robsey has just said (and everyone else a million times) this is the wire from the ignition switch(key) that makes the starter turn over. So if its turning over then forget that wire all together as it is NOT that.

As for that black wire that could be from anything, my guess is its nothing at all and was part of an old immobiliser circuit which has been joined back up so not needed anymore but I could be wrong.

We need LOADS more picks of the wiring from all different angles close up etc.. the pictures you take are crap!

Ive said before that the gsi I took the xe out of had an after market alarm fitted to it but was unsure if it was part of the old alarm or the cav's wireing and I checked Haynes manual and on the charging/starter loom these two wires are on the starter loom but wanted to conferm them first ill get pictures up asap

[joe cavalier sri]

Rate good news and bad new about my cav but ill let Troy get home and let you guys know but it took 6 hours to find but everything has been checked cheers Troy ill let you tell everyone on here

[Super89]

Good news? It now runs.... bad news its burning oil or something lol?

[btcctroy]

Well after Joe drowning me with coffee and a mountain of biscuits, decided start from scratch.
First off i quickly checked the timing - which appeared to be fine.
Connected battery to turn it over, turned key and nothing so replaced starter loom and grounded the block as this wasn't done. (loom was all brittle and broken)
Still nothing so found faulty connection at the ignition barrel.
Now it turned over and there is a spark. No fuel in cylinder 1.
So tested the ecu plug for 12v supplies and checked numerous earth connections - all appeared fine.
Again checked fuel relay and was working as it should - so tested for 12v at injectors - again this appear fine.
Turned it over whilst testing the pins on the injector and scale was fluctuating to indicate the injector supply was switching as it should.
So removed the injector rail reconnected earths to inlet and turned it over. Only injectors or 2 and 3 were squirting. So swaped injector 3 and 4 and now 2 and 4 squirt.
So he requires a set of working injectors, never have come across this on an xe before

[planetc]

Ha, five hours on biscuits, 1 hour to diagnose, lol

[btcctroy]

Something like that.
Remember Paul your a proffessional, also this engine has never run properly.