Starting Problem

[marksmith]

can someone advise me the likely cause to the starting problems I am having on one of my Cavs.

Here is the story. The previous owner ( a mate of mine ) took the car for an Mot in July and it passed. However, my mate then got given a new car by his girl and so the Cav sat up in a barn doing nothing. Its covered just 3 miles since the Mot and that was driving it back from the test station only. Its not been started since July but was running perfect then.

I towed it to my house when I bought it from him ( for a measly £20 ! ) as I was going to use it for spares. However, I think its too nice to break. I charged the battery up and the car would not start. It was not even close to starting

I left it a week and tried it again and amazingly it started first go without any trouble at all. The thing is though, the very second I touched the accelerator pedal it stalled and would not start again. I left it a couple of hours and tried it again and once again it started and stalled the second I touched the accelerator.

I left it til the next day and tried it again. This time it started first go again and when I pressed the accelerator it revved fine and all seemed perfect. i took it for a quick run down the road and it drove lovely and sounded very healthy. I parked it up and went in for a cuppa and tried to start the car again an hour later and again it would not start.

I left it til the next day ( this morning ) when I pulled it out of the garage to valet it today. The tyre had gone flat overnight but that was not a problem. However, once again, she failed to start.

Can anyone shed any light onto why the car is finding it so hard to start most of the time, but occasionally starts first time and stalls the very second I touch the gas pedal, and on one rare occasion it started and ran perfectly ????

My mechanical knowledge is ZERO and I have not got a clue what it could be, or how to sort it. However, I have had a mate check the following.....

There IS fuel reaching the carb
All 4 plugs ARE sparking

[Gaz]

If it only ran from stone cold id say coolant temp sensor, might be worth a go, has it got fresh petrol?

[marksmith]

Yes, fresh petrol ( about £10 worth ) was put into an almost empty tank.

It ran from stone cold, but that one time I got it started I ran it til it was nice and warm and switched it off, and it still started 20 minutes later on that occasion but failed to start about an hour after that.

[humbucker]

have you got another battery you can test it out with? might be worth crossing the easy things off the list early on

[marksmith]

have you got another battery you can test it out with? might be worth crossing the easy things off the list early on

Yes mate, tried a couple of good batteries on there and there was no change between them.

(( Always got a good amount of batteries here as my other passion is the Sinclair C5, got 12 of them, and they take the same 12v battery as the Cav ))

[humbucker]

have you got another battery you can test it out with? might be worth crossing the easy things off the list early on

Yes mate, tried a couple of good batteries on there and there was no change between them.

(( Always got a good amount of batteries here as my other passion is the Sinclair C5, got 12 of them, and they take the same 12v battery as the Cav ))

ok, i won't respond at length here cos we'll go off topic but PLLLEEEAAASSSEE get some sinclair c5 shots up in the 'other showroom' section. you can't play 'horace goes skiing' on them but they are awesome!

[marksmith]

have you got another battery you can test it out with? might be worth crossing the easy things off the list early on

Yes mate, tried a couple of good batteries on there and there was no change between them.

(( Always got a good amount of batteries here as my other passion is the Sinclair C5, got 12 of them, and they take the same 12v battery as the Cav ))

ok, i won't respond at length here cos we'll go off topic but PLLLEEEAAASSSEE get some sinclair c5 shots up in the 'other showroom' section. you can't play 'horace goes skiing' on them but they are awesome!

No problem mate. I will get some pics sorted out in the next few days as all the pics I have are on my old computer and thats not working, but I will take some more

They are great fun and fully road legal for anyone over aged 14, no mot, tax or insurance needed either. They do 14mph, or 30mph if you fit the 24v conversion and will do 10-15 miles a charge !!

[Robsey]

I would suggest the coolant temperature sensor..


Also clean up all the usual stuff..
HT lead connections,
Rotor
Dizzy cap contacts,
plugs etc...

sounds like a basic service will sort most of this.

Slightly off-topic, but back in 1994 to 95, I did a years YTS at Ferranti Instrumentation in New Moston, North Manchester.

The products made there were

Navigation Controls for the Tornado Fighter Jet
Electricity consumption Meters (in your electric cupboard)
"GTE" Telecommunications equipment,
AND

Sinclair C5 control units...

(don't ask me which part - I don't know.. I was a 16 yr old grunt in the training school)

[Squig]

I'd say you have a vacuum leak, it's been a hell of a long time since I was near an 8v but cathy golf has a rubber "adapter" between carb and manifold this spit and caused similar (but to a lesser degree) symptoms... worth checking?

[TurboSteven77]

check you havent suckt all shit up fuelline to singel engetor if its been sitting that long

also dont use v power old cavaliers no like it well any i tried with it didnt

hth

[planetc]

What engine is in it, how old is it?

[marksmith]

Thanks for the replies.

The enigine is a 1.8 and its a 1991 J Reg.

How do I check for and cure vacumn leaks and how do I check the temp coolant sensor ?

Thanks for the help guys.

[Squig]

ideally remove the carb and inspect the rubber mount within carb and manifold... just not sure if vauxhalls have them... it's been a very long time since I worked on a Vaux carb

[marksmith]

Ok, so I have tried all of those things to no avail. Everything on the car seems to be doing what it is suppose to do except actually start running !


I am starting to give up now, which is a shame as its not in bad condition at all ( as can be seem from the valet guides I have done ).

I love this car but it just wont start, which is crazy as it did run a few days ago and was perfect.

The only thing I have not checked is the coolent sensor - can someone tell me how/what to do for this please ?

Might have to start considering saving my cash for another Cav or to take this one to a mechanic, but will have to wait a while as there is not much work for valeting this time of year

Anyone got any last final suggestions of what I can try ? I would be very greatful

[Envoy CDX]

Get some easy start into the carb and give that a crack. just a sniff should do.
Theres a return feed round the back of the carb that is prone to leaking / perishing also which allows too much air into the mix.

Failing that, fouled plugs, or CTS is faulty (£5 new, and you only need 2 13mm spanners and a deep 19mm socket and rachet to fit it) and giving mixed signals.

18SV is the engine code, and they do respond well to VPower with the correct ron plug (of only to give the lines a clear out).

[supersport]

is this the auto one? it could be something to do with the inhibiter switch as some autos wont
start unless it's in park.

[Squig]

I think the chaps hit the nail on the noggin... could an inhibitor switch be faulty/corroded so even when it's in park it won't start

[Squig]

Do you have a haynes?

[planetc]

Does the starter kick in and turn the engine over? Think we all assumed it did until those last couple of posts, if it does then it is not gonna be an inhibitor issue. Again, if it does, I just read back through the topic, it might be worth looking at the choke mass.

[marksmith]

No, sorry, I dont have a Hanyes.

If its got a faulty inhibitor switch would the car still turn over ?

The car turns over fine, just wont fire up and start, except on the one occasion it did start.

Just to confirm, it is a 1.8 with Auto Box

[marksmith]

Just tried it again, with a fully charged battery. It turned over fine and "tried" to start by firing a little before going back to the norm which is turning over fine but not firing at all.

Strong smell of petrol coming from engine too.

[marksmith]

Does the starter kick in and turn the engine over? Think we all assumed it did until those last couple of posts, if it does then it is not gonna be an inhibitor issue. Again, if it does, I just read back through the topic, it might be worth looking at the choke mass.

Can you tell me where to find the choke mass, what to check for and how to rectify it if it is fauly please mate ?

My mechanical knowledge is very low

[TurboSteven77]

see when you trying to start it you ant pumping acelater pedal are you ?

as you might have flooded it if you have

also check fule pump is still priming ok and its not got blockt

check you are getting spark as well 1 at time and tbh a two man job hold it against metal on engine
with pliers no bare hands and othere person turn car over

ps ask mate to hold spark plug lol

also check all spark plugs are in good condtion if been sitting for long while good need new 1s

also double check fuel is ok might have bad batch of fuel

pps make sure its in park and not drive

[planetc]

Does the starter kick in and turn the engine over? Think we all assumed it did until those last couple of posts, if it does then it is not gonna be an inhibitor issue. Again, if it does, I just read back through the topic, it might be worth looking at the choke mass.

Can you tell me where to find the choke mass, what to check for and how to rectify it if it is fauly please mate ?

My mechanical knowledge is very low

On the side of the carb, the thing with the pipes going to it in this picture

carb.jpg (59.31 KiB) Viewed 1338 times

It is held on by three screws, mark the domed casing so that you can refit in the same orientation as it was removed, remove the screws and pull off the assembly (sometimes it needs a tap). Inside there is a flat coiled bimetallic spring that locates over a lever arm to operate the choke on the carb. Behind this is a fine wire heating coil that sits in a ceramic holder. All these parts should be firmly attached to the metal casing and if they are not then you will have random choke operation and hence poor starting. It can give choke when it's not needed and equally none when it is needed. They can get really bad sometimes and when you remove the 3 screws it all falls apart. The cure is to replace the unit.

[Squig]

No, sorry, I dont have a Hanyes.

If its got a faulty inhibitor switch would the car still turn over ?

The car turns over fine, just wont fire up and start, except on the one occasion it did start.

Just to confirm, it is a 1.8 with Auto Box

Not the inhibitor then. I would buy a haynes as it's helpful when doing the simple jobs and some of the more difficult ones.